Episode 012 Transcript- Breaking Up is Hard to Do

Megan: Welcome to Queers Next Door
Leigh: with your hosts Leigh and Megan.
M: We take the topics you care about:
L: sex, relationships, feminism, kink, social justice, and entertainment,
M: and look at them through a queer as fuck lens.
L: Find us on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook at Queers Next Door
M: and make sure to follow the blog at queersnextdoor.com.


L: Cheers, queers!M: Hi.
L: Heyy.
M: Hi Leigh. What are you doing to take care of yourself this…month?
Both: (laugh)
L: Why, it has been a month. I am, as always, therapy is…I started seeing a new therapist, a somatic therapist, which is more like, you know, feeling your feelings in your body and working them out, especially related to trauma. I just started it, so hopefully next time I can give some more updates on how that’s going. But I like her a lot so I’m looking forward to it. There was a day like a couple weeks ago where I went to therapy four times (laughs) in one week, between my regular therapist, my couples therapist, and my somatic therapist, so, that’s a thing. A good PMDD update is I’ve now been going through menopause for about three months, and it’s been like working and removing all my PMDD symptoms for the last two months. So that’s just like such a huge thing that I don’t even really like know where to go with it, except that like I feel like my brain is okay for the first time literally ever. (laughs) So it’s kind of a weird identity crisis. It’s really good though. So that’s a positive thing. I’m going to have my ovaries removed. I have been okay’d for surgery but not scheduled. So hopefully in the next few months, tops. I’m not sure. So I will update on that. But it shouldn’t be too big of a surgery. And then, yeah, my main self care is, has been just like crying when I need to cry. My partner and I broke up, which we will talk about more. But going through this without PMDD is like weirdly a gift because I know that all of my crying is quote “real” and not based on what’s going on like, chemically, hormonally, et cetera. So it feels more authentic to me but it also fucking sucks.
M: Yeah.
L: Yeah. So Megan, what have you been doing to take care of yourself?
M: I have been taking my medication.
L: Good.
M: So last time we recorded, we were like, “Yay! Half the year’s over!”
Both: (laugh)
M: We were so hopeful. And we kept talking about fucking joy and I said…
L: We were so young back then.
Both: (laugh)
M: This was the episode where we went all Brenè Brown and then like literally hours after we recorded that, like everything took a fucking shit.
L: It did.
M: And everything was a mess. And we’ve been like hinting at it on social media…well, I have, like on our Twitter,
L: Yeah.
M: Instagram…but we haven’t been posting as much, we haven’t recorded, so, but last time I did talk about being diagnosed bipolar and I started medication but I immediately hated the Risperdal and that’s the mood stabilizer.
L: Mmhm.
M: So I was on Prozac and that and then some other stuff. But I stopped taking that pretty quickly and I was gonna see my psychiatrist three weeks later. I went back to her, told her I wasn’t taking it. And she was like, “Okay. That’s fine. But you need something else.” So she prescribed me Abilify. I couldn’t get it approved and I just stopped trying.
L: Mmhm.
M: And I thought, like, “Well, at least I’m on Prozac.” You know? Eventually we’ll get this other thing sorted out, unaware that it could be really bad for bipolar folks to take only an antidepressant.
L: Right.
M: So, about like five and half weeks into the Prozac, I had like the worst weekend of my life, and that’s saying a lot, considering that I’ve been through like a horrible crime. (laughs)
L: Yeah.
M: So it was really, really bad. And I, which I guess I’ll put it in the notes but like also trigger warning and content warning, for some suicidal ideation and mental health stuff.
L: Yeah.
M: I thought, “Oh. It’s because I had a breakup.” And we talked about me and my ex-partner breaking up on the last episode, but we…It ended up changing. It got a lot more traumatic
L: Yeah.
M: than how it was on that episode. And it’s not her fault. It’s just, something happening. We’ll go into that later but, I was like, “Oh. It must be this breakup. I’m just having a really bad reaction.” And then I was like, “No. I’ve never felt this bad before.” And I started to feel like I wanted to rip my skin off.
L: Mmm.
M: And I’ve felt a lot of bad feelings with anxiety and PTSD and depression but I’ve never felt this way. And then I realized, okay, it’s been like about the time they said Prozac will start hitting me.
L: Yeah.
M: I mean, that’s probably not how you say it, hitting me. But you know what I mean, right?
L: No, I, sure.
M: My symptoms.
L: Yeah.
M: And I started to google, because I didn’t know what else to do. And I was like, there was a…I live…I temporarily had these roommates and they were having like a party downstairs and I was crying hysterically, like wailing.
L: Mmhm.
M: I knew they probably couldn’t hear me because they were doing a game night. Or I hoped they couldn’t. But I was googling to try to like, I just needed to calm down, and like, anything to like find some kind of center in that.
L: Sure.
M: And that’s when I read about, it could make you suicidal
L: (inhales deeply)
M: if you’re bipolar. I mean I guess it could even if you’re not.
L: Sure.
M: But like there’s a higher chance if you’re not taking the mood stabilizer. So I ended…that was the next, that was a Sunday night. So I called on Monday and I was like, “I…Something is wrong.” But I also was too afraid to be like, “Hey. I want to kill myself.”
L: Right.
M: ‘Cause I didn’t know what that would do. I don’t know what they were gonna do to me, if they were gonna be like, “You need to come.” I was also having like a job interview that day. (laughs)
L: Fun times.
M: I’m like, “I can’t not get this job because of this because I’m moving and my rent is going up”
L: Sure. Of course.
M: “a shitload.” Yeah. So just so many things. But I was trying to calmly explain to them that like, this is a dire situation. (laughs)
L: Yeah.
M: And they were just like, “Okay, you know, let’s go back and forth again with your insurance” and I’m like, “No.”
So I’m talking to my friend Dawn, ’cause she told me I can use her name. She’s very good with all this. And she was like, “No. Tell them you’re coming in tomorrow.” And so I’m like, “Okay.” So I told them and they let me come in and once I was there, in person, it was a lot easier.
L: Yeah, sure.
M: And she was explaining to me that, yes, you should not just be on antidepressants. You need the other part too. So after that I was able to get it started like a few days later. And I do feel a little bit better but it’s still, I’ve been feeling very hopeless a lot of times because, now understanding that being bipolar II and like the way that the last year and a half has been for me, my favorite part of myself was the mania. It was so good.
L: Got it. Yeah. What did the mania look like for you?
M: I would, ’cause I’ve been diagnosed with insomnia since my mom’s murder.
L: Sure.
M: So that made a lot of sense to me. So I’m just, I just don’t sleep.
L: Right. That’s what I would have assumed
M: Yeah.
L: with you anytime you talk about being kind of up and doing all this stuff, is like,
M: Yeah.
L: well, of course. Sleep is traumatic.
M: Yeah. I just don’t sleep and that’s fine. But I didn’t really ever put it together that I was having more energy
L: Mmm.
M: the times after I didn’t sleep.
L: Yeah. Okay.
M: I mean, sometimes my body would like start, I could feel like myself shutting down a little bit but then I was able to like, pick myself back up and keep going and I would clean and I would cam and I would be very creative and everything was great. I was in such a good mood. It felt like NRE
L: Yeah.
M: but about life.
L: Yeah.
M: Like everything’s great. And so, in those moments, it’s really hard to be like, I’m doing worse than I have ever been. Because you’re like, “I feel so good. Everything’s great. I almost don’t even feel like my mom has been murdered.” Because that’s been this thing in my head, like “That’s what my issue is,” forever,
L: Of course.
M: my mom’s murder. I don’t sleep because of it. I don’t do this because of it. And I would be like, “Wow. I feel so great.” Like being on drugs. And then I would have a week or so, or less, where I can’t get out of bed and I’m like  really depressed. And those moments, I would be like, “Well, of course it makes sense I’m depressed. I’m grieving. I’m blah blah blah.”
L: Yeah.
M: So that’s what it was like. So the depression is a lot better. I don’t have that anymore, where I can’t get out of bed. But also life is so different. I don’t feel like I’m really normalized in any way
L: Yeah.
M: because I moved. I am not dating anybody. And last time I had just broken up with someone and I was dating someone else.
L: Right.
M: I’m completely single for the first time in years.
L: We’re both single for the first time in years,
M: Oh my gosh!
L: like totally single.
M: It’s, what is it, it’s almost fuckgirl fall so get ready.
L: It is almost fuckgirl fall.
M: If we can stop crying long enough. (laughs)
L: Oh, we’re gonna get there.
M: So yeah. I don’t know yet even what my balance or normal will look like
L: Yep.
M: because it’s been so far off and I started medication during this process.
L: Sure.
M: But I do feel better. I feel a little bit like sometimes I’ll just be happy. And I’m like, “Oh. This is a good feeling.”
L: Right?
M: And I get like, stressed about it because I’m afraid it’s gonna go away.
L: Yep.
M: (laughs) And so after, I think September 20 will be six weeks since I’ve been on both plus I’m also on methylfolate, which is supposed to be super helpful
L: Okay.
M: with some genetic mutation.
L: Okay.
M: So at that point…
L: Oh wait, what- Do you know what it’s called? Your genertic mutation.
M: (says sadly) Nooo. Why, are…
L: Is it the one- Well, I’m just making a weird guess but like, folate is similar, is the same as folic acid, right?
M: Yeah. Uh huh.
L: And that’s something you’re supposed to take before you have a baby,
M: Uh huh.
L: like way before you even know you’re gonna have a baby. So if you’re a person who may want to have a baby in your body, then make sure you’re taking your folic acid, because it helps prevent against birth defects. But there is also this like very interesting genetic thing that some pregnant women have.
M: Mmhm.
L: And they have to take like different medicine and I just wonder if it’s that.
M: Oh, maybe.
L: It has like a number in it. Is that helpful?
Both: (laugh)
L: There’s like a five. I don’t know what it’s called. I can’t remember.
M: I have to google it afterwards.
L: Okay. I’m curious. But anyway. You’re taking your- So you’re taking all your medication.
M: Yeah. But, and that’s basically it for this. But I just want to- ‘Cause I know there are a lot of people who have, obviously, who are bipolar, mental health stuff. The thing that I’m struggling with that I want to communicate, and I even told you about at lunch, I want to start writing about it, for the first time in like, a year, I want to write,
L: Yeah.
M: because it’s been such a confusing journey, so far. And I’m really grieving like parts of myself with this new medication. But also I feel very hopeless that I wasn’t suicidal so much, or had the suicidal ideation, before I started medication. So sometimes I’m like, “Why the fuck am I taking anything?”
L: Yeah.
M: And yes, some parts of it were bad but some parts of it were really good and now I’m just gonna lose everything because of this? So, that’s a whole thing and I want to like say it and put it out there because in six weeks from now, I want to be able to talk about if it’s gotten better or worse. And I know it’s different for everyone.
L: Yeah.
M: But I also know it’s helpful for people to hear the conversations and to hear, like maybe if someone else is starting medication and feeling this way, don’t kill yourself hopefully.
L: Well, yeah, because, and even
M: (laughs) Because, yeah.
L: I would suggest too if you’re starting a new medication, that that’s a possibility,
M: Yeah.
L: have somebody in your life that you’re really checking in about with,
M: Mmhm.
L: to be like, “Hey. So I’m taking this medication right now.”
M: Yeah.
L: “I don’t know what happens.” So if they notice, like, some serious mood changes,
M: Yeah.
L: then they can kind of help you point that out too,
M: Mmhm.
L: because yes, you don’t want to be taking something
M: Yeah.
L: that’s making you suicidal or even making you have suicidal ideation,
M: Yeah.
L: which, if people don’t know that phrase, is just a more like, passive form of like, thinking you want to die but not
M: Yeah.
L: like having a plan or anything. So yeah, like
M: And my psychiatrist, I don’t want to say she didn’t do a good job. I just think they’re busy and they’re, you know, this is their profession. So I don’t feel like I was really adequately prepared between therapy and my psychiatrist, for that.
L: Yep.
M: And the thing that, since I have a lot of friends and people in my life who I can to go to with this. And someone’s even reached out to me who listens to the podcast. And I am gonna talk with her and then after that I’ll update everyone. That was about dealing with bipolar with a diet.
L: Oh right.
M: All my friends who know a lot about this stuff say the good thing about me that they don’t hear everyone else having, is that I have language for it.
L: Right, sure.
M: And I’m able to like, I can be feeling this way and also talk my way through it and like, rationalize it in a weird way. And that’s because I’ve been dealing with this shit for like 13 years. And a lot of people, if you’re not prepared for it, I can only imagine that the feeling just like sweeps you away, ’cause I was like, “I want to rip my skin off.” And, “Nothing feels good.” And not even doing drugs, drinking, nothing is gonna make this go away.
L: Right.
M: So I can see why people end up being like, “The only way out is to die.”
L: Yeah. And
M: And if you don’t know what’s happening to you, I can only imagine that you’re just like, “What the fuck?”
L: And psych meds are life savers. But if you’re not getting the right dose
M: Mmhm.
L: or if you’re having these serious side effects, like they’re not. So like making sure just that like…I think the hardest journey to being in a good place with medication is that you have to find that right dose,
M: Mmhm.
L: especially like, my guess would be especially with bipolar if it’s like extra high highs and extra low lows, to find a place where you’re like, you feel steady but not like you’re just dulling everything
M: Yeah!
L: has gotta be hard.
M: Mmhm.
L: I first went on…One medication that I first went on when my anxiety was really bad…I went from having terrible anxiety to sleeping like 18 hours a day
M: Oh my gosh.
L: and being unable to cry and so like
M: Ugh.
L: comparatively to feeling like I was going out of mind, ’cause it was treating anxiety and OCD, which I really wasn’t treating, so I was like in thought loops and felt crazy. So the rest was needed but I didn’t feel like I could process emotions in like a normal way. Like I literally couldn’t cry.
M: Yeah.
L: So that sucked too. Meh.
M: Yeah. There’s benefits and then downfalls and, or drawbacks. I don’t know. I can’t talk. I don’t know words anymore.
L: That’s a good word.
M: But (laughs) but it’s just like I just keep telling myself like, “Hang in there.”
L: Yeah.
M: And I have this awesome platform where I feel very lucky that like we can do this with our life and we can talk about things and people are listening and reaching out and being like, “I experience this.”
L: Yeah.
M: Or “Have you tried this?” And it feels very like warm and like, “Okay. Hold on. We can get through all this shit.”
L: We really can.
M: So on that note, we got an email from a, I always want to say reader,
L: (laughs)
M: from a listener.
L: From a listener. Hey, you don’t know. Maybe they read the transcripts.
M: (laughs) Maybe.
L: Then they are a reader.
M: True. Readers and listeners, everybody, you’re welcome to email us anytime and we’ll try to answer you if we can.
L: Yeah, we love to do that. You’re gonna read the question, correct?
M: Yes.
L: Okay.
M: This is called Question from a Sober Queer.
Both: (laugh)
M: It had to recognize my face for my iPhone to open.
L: Oh, nice.
M: (laughs)
L: I never set mine up like that.
M: Yeah, well, and I wear so many different glasses that it has a hard time…I have like 15 pair of glasses, so, anyways.”Hi Megan and Leigh. Thank you for making your podcast. It’s really interesting and affirming to listen to both of you. This might be more relevant to Leigh, but I’d really appreciate hearing more about your journey with alcoholism. After tremendous struggles with mental health stuff, trauma, an eating disorder, and alcoholism that was totally out of control, I found myself desperate and in AA at 27. I’ve been sober in 12 Step for almost six years, and while it’s really important to me to be sober, I’ve struggled a lot with certain aspects of the 12 Step model for so many reasons and I’m finally at a point that I want to try a sober life without it. I guess my question is this: How have you taken care of your alcoholism? I really appreciate how intentional you both are about sharing your self-care/community care and I think that’s a huge part of taking care of our whole selves. But are there specific ways you took or take care of alcoholism?
Sending queer femme love,
SarahL: Awesome. Thank you Sarah. Yeah, it sounds like your experience is maybe pretty similar to mine. So I first – I know I’ve talked about this on here before – but I first went to an AA meeting when I was really, like, 21 or 22, and I was like yeeeah, this is probably me, but I’m not ready. And then when I was 25 I did 90 days sober going to meetings, but it was right in the middle of a move, my move like from the midwest to LA and so it was just too much. So I got sober right after I turned 30. So it’ll be 10 years in October. And just to clarify, because you hear, because you’ve heard us talk about smoking weed. For me, my sobriety, I don’t do a lot of drugs, but my sobriety is sobriety from alcohol. I would not be considered capital S Sober in the like Sobriety or AA community. But I am very much an alcoholic who has not had a drink in almost 10 years. When I first got sober, I did the same thing you did, which is, you know, I went to AA. Everything was pretty out of control in my life. And for me, I only did AA, although I was very involved for about a year and a half and so, not sure what your reasons are, although I can guess some of them. But like my reasons for not wanting to do AA was that it felt like it, like I was kinda being forced into community with folks who maybe wouldn’t be people I would be in community with. I thought there was like kind of unnecessary drama. Like one day it just kind of hit me that I felt like I was feeling like an obligation to hang out with these people. And it wasn’t necessarily helping my sobriety. It was just having me talk about alcoholism so often that it made my alcoholism more present in a way that it was starting to feel less present, if that makes sense.
M: Mmhm.
L: So that’s why I stopped going. I think what I’ve done since, I mean, you know, therapy’s huge. Obviously I’ve talked about that. I talked about it like ten minutes ago. I have been in therapy the whole time that I’ve been sober. The other thing is like I talk to people about it. And I, you know, your mileage may vary there, but I feel like if somebody asks me if I want a drink or why I don’t drink, you don’t owe people your life story, but I think it’s important to normalize alcoholism. So I always say like, “Oh, like, I’m an alcoholic. I don’t drink anymore.” Karen, from My Favorite Murder, always says, “I drank all mine already,”
Both: (laugh)
L: which I like ’cause that’s kinda how I feel too is like, “I can’t have any more. I drank all mine.” So it’s, I don’t know what I do. It’s interesting because I don’t know what I would say I do day-to-day to kind of manage my alcoholism. But I take the things that I learned in AA, like some of the little platitudes and phrases and the little one day at a time kind of idea. Like I take the parts that were useful for me and I think about them. I remember especially the idea of like there’s an idea in AA that’s about like playing the tape all the way through, which like is like if you picture yourself drinking. Like if I picture myself drinking right now, like if Megan and I sat here and had a glass of wine, I’d be fine. That’s the thing. Like I would be fine. I might be fine doing that regularly for a few months even. But I know how my brain works and I know what happens and so if I play that tape all the way through, it becomes, yeah but then you start justifying, like, “Well why have one if, like why not have two if you feel like having two? You’re an adult. You can make your own choices. Like what is this arbitrary number that says you can only have one?” And then this thing just like takes over my brain. So remembering to play the tape through, remembering to celebrate like milestones in my sobriety, even if I’m not going to meetings. You know, I do a social media post every year and yeah, I think just having this like kind of like normalizing and just checking in with myself. Like if there are times when I feel like the desire to drink is going to come up, knowing that there are people to reach out to or that I can go back to AA meetings without being like fully entrenched in the world of AA or the world of 12 Steps.  There’s still… The best part of a 12 Step program is that if you wake in the morning one day and you say, “I literally can’t have another drink,” there’s a meeting going on right at that moment. And I think that convenience and accessibility was huge ’cause it’s so easy to talk yourself out of doing the thing that’s best for you. So that was really helpful for me. I think also making sure that you have…I mean, and you’ve been sober for six years so I’m sure you know all this, but like making sure that you are part of a community that, even if they’re not sober, is not fully centered around drinking. Like my queer community is not super like alcohol focused even though I wouldn’t say that there’s a ton of sober people in it. So I think like just being conscious that you’re community is people who, like that’s not the main reason they’re out, you know, and it’s not all about bars and things like that because, you know, like it can hard to have it that close all the time. So that was a really long answer but I don’t know, I hope that that’s helpful in some way. Also just want to say like, congratulations, getting sober is fucking hard.
M: Congrats!
L: And so, I’m really proud of you.
M: I’m proud of you too, Sarah and also Leigh. That was a great answer. And I’m always proud of Leigh ’cause I do see her social media posts and I’ve always been like an oversharer, but it’s also inspiring to see someone else who struggles with things differently but, you know, like alcoholism, I see you sharing it and people responding either like, “Oh, I’ve been there.” Or, “I”m proud of you.” And it’s like, “Awww.” It’s just making it more, like you said, more normalized, even for me to reach out for help in other ways,
L: Yeah.
M: like talking about grief stuff or anything, so
L: Awww.
M: So I’m proud of you too.
L: Thank you.
M: You’re welcome.
L: Speaking of like, nice, happy things
M: (laughs)
L: I also want to say happy birthday Megan!
M: Oh, thank you!
L: Megan’s birthday was yesterday.
M: That feels like forever ago. I already forgot.
L: I know, right?
M: (laughs)
L: Before we recorded, you were like, “So on my birth- Was that yesterday?”
M: It was yesterday.
L: So it was yesterday.
M: It feels like years ago.
L: Last time you heard from us it was my birthday. Yesterday was Megan’s. Megan, how old are you?
M: 32.
L: 32. That’s what I thought. So happy 32 Megan.
M: Thank you. Yesterday I was with my family and I had a really funny queer moment because my father…where my nana lives now is actually the house I was brought home to
L: Oh, okay.
M: as an infant. So I lived there until I was, I think two a half of so.
L: Mmhm.
M: And then my dad lived there so I would visit him
L: Mmhm.
M: off and on when I was a kid. And I remember in his room, he had either a poster, no he had a calendar with Elvira.
L: Oh, nice.
M: And for some reason yesterday, we were talking about memories. And I was like, “Do you remember you had an Elvira calendar or magazine? You had something.” And he was like, “Oh yeah. She’s so hot. I love her. I have a huge crush on her.” And I was like, “Me too.”
L: (laughs)
M: And he looked at me and like and then he’s like, “Oh yeah. I forgot.” Like
Both: (laugh)
M: He forgot that I’m
L: That you…
M: That I’m a queer person.
L: Aww.
M: And so he like laughed and then everyone in my family was laughing and I thought that was really funny ’cause I was like, “Awww. This is…” You know, I remember he loved her and I would be like, “Oooh! I like this lady. She’s so pretty!” (laughs)
L: That’s really cute. I love it.
M: And then we were both like, “Well I guess we both have a crush on a 70 year old woman.” So that’s amazing.
Both: (laugh)
L: That’s really funny.
M: So that’s my fun birthday story.
L: I love it. Should we
M: Dive right into the good stuff.
L: Dive into the, yeah
M: Breakups.
L: Breakup time!
M: (laughs) Oh god.
L: This is episode 12, which, so this is the end of our first season, and we thought, what a fitting way to end, to talk about breakups, but, you know, Megan and I have both been through, like, the breakup of our longest
M: Mmhm.
L: relationsh- or our current like serious relationship that we kind of expected to last
Both: forever
M: (groans) Ohhhh
L: So that’s like, it’s a lot. Megan’s been through some other breakups too.
M: (sighs)
L: And yeah, we’re gonna end by talking about that and especially what breakups look
M: Mmhm.
L: like in a kind of, like queer and polyamorous way ’cause I know this feels very different than my last big breakup, which was my divorce.
M: Mmhm. Same.
L: And not just because I wanted out of that relationship and this is a lot more nuanced but just the community, the way I do relationships, it feels very different. Yeah, and then we’re gonna, and then we’re gonna come back after this.
M: I was gonna say, well, we’re not breaking up as Queers Next Door.
L: We are not.
M: We will be back.
L: We’ll be back.
M: We’re gonna take a new photo. I keep mentioning it ’cause I’m so excited.
L: (laughs) We’re really excited to go shopping,
M: (laughs)
L: take a new photo, start a new season, and with a, I don’t know exactly what day we’re starting, so
M: We’ll let you know.
L: please hold. We’ll let you know on the social media, but with the goal of putting out two episodes a month.
M: Yes. That was our initial goal and somewhere
L: You know.
M: things came up.
L: It was a-
M: Things kept happening.
L: As they used to say in like corporate shit, it was a stretch goal.
M: Yeah.
L: We did not make our stretch goal, but it’s always important to have them.
M: Yeah. So next time we will do better.
L: Yep.
M: ‘Cause so many things are changing and have changed and (makes disgusted noise), I just can’t stop making weird noises about it
L: (laughs)
M: ’cause I just don’t know what else to do in response to like everything.
L: I know and I guess well I think it’s important to point out that like the biggest barriers to consistency in this little project that we’re doing have been like health and mental health and location and as Megan and I are both like really taking measures to better manage our mental illnesses, physical illnesses, etc. Also Megan has moved closer and so I think that combination is going to make it easier for us.
M: Yes. That is true. I just realized that. We’ve both really spent this last year working on mental health and physical health and then we both had breakups at the same time.
L: Yep.
M: And then now I’m moving closer to you so all the things are coming into place, hopefully.
L: Yeah.
M: So that’s good. But yeah, where do we start with the breakups? (laughs)
L: Well, I don’t know. We’ve been texting each other like to see what phase of the breakup we’re in lately, how much we’re crying. I guess, so just a like a little, I’m not gonna tell like a lot of specific details but just for the sake of transparency, I did ask my, it’s really hard to call her my ex
M: Mmhm.
L: ’cause it’s only been two weeks.
M: Yeah.
L: My former partner. (laughs) I don’t know. She has always said it’s okay for me to talk about her on the podcast,
M: Mmhm.
L: but I did ask her if she felt okay me talking about the breakup and she said yes and I just wanted to make sure that that was acknowledged. Yeah, so, we were, we’ve lived close to each other for most of our relationship, but she had moved in part-time and about…This has been a really weird year for me and I have no sense of time but I want to say about six months ago. But she’s gonna be moving out and I think no matter what happens in our future, like that is, that was the thing. And the case I want to make there, the one thing I want to bring up there is something that I tell my coaching clients all the time and I wish I maybe would have listened better, is that sometimes compromise is just bad for both people. Sometimes when one person wants one thing and the other person wants another thing, we think that the solution is to compromise. And I think that sometimes the compromise just means both people aren’t getting their needs met.
M: Mmhm.
L: And, you know, there’s more to it than that. But I think we made a choice that just wasn’t, that was with all the best intentions but not in our best interest. So, the moving out, you know, most of our relationship, we had been together for almost four years. Most of our relationship was like living closely but not living together so that part is going to be, I think just really healthy.
M: Mmhm.
L: That part, I feel like, maybe the whole breakup, whether it’s forever or not was worth it just to not try to do this thing that wasn’t working.
M: Yeah.
L: So, yeah, you know, I talked a little bit like, you know, I have a, we have a kid who spends weekends with her bio dad and her stepmom and then my former partner, even though we’re not married, is a stepmom as well and that relationship isn’t gonna change so there’s a lot of navigating around that too.
M: Mmhm.
L: I’ll let Megan talk a little bit and I’ll come back to it, but, yeah.

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M: So last time we recorded I was like, “Oh me and my ex partner are transitioning our relationship from like romantically together to just friends and like maybe we’ll be best friends and we’re always gonna be in each other’s lives.” And a few weeks after that, she was like, “No. I can’t talk to you anymore.”
L: Yeah.
M: “I am gonna put some boundaries on this.” And we kind of had a few negative interactions and I was just really not expecting it.
L: Mmhm.
M: And I think one of the things I’ve talked to all of my, ’cause like all of my friends are polyamorous or nonmonogamous basically.
L: Yeah.
M: And so
L: Most
M: Yeah, and
L: Most of mine are, yeah as well.
M: queer. Like I
L: Sure.
M: That’s my life. It’s like in this bubble of that.
L: Yep.
M: And so, I was really struggling with, “Did polyamory ruin our relationship?”
L: Okay. Sure.
M: And one of the things I thought is, let’s say it did. The benefit of it is, we could remain friends no matter what now. Because a huge trigger for people is dating other people. Well, when we broke up we were both dating other people.
L: Right.
M: And so I thought, “What else could be something that we couldn’t work through? We could stay friends. We could be in each other’s lives forever. Why not?”
L: Yep.
M: And now here we are and we’re not and in addition to that, going through like the medication stuff, and the feeling of like, we’ve talked about so much about boundaries and other people’s boundaries not, you know, like not taking it personally, but at the same time being like, “I am a fucking wreck and I wanna die and the one person who’s been in my life for the last four years who’s been my calming person won’t talk to me anymore.”
L: That’s a big fucking deal.
M: And it’s not okay.
L: Yeah.
M: So I don’t want to be mad at her. And it’s not her job. So I have to let go and respect her boundaries. But at the same time, like getting like filled with rage
L: You’re allowed to be mad.
M: that I was, “I would never do this to you.”
L: Yep.
M: But I don’t know what it’s like for her.
L: Yep.
M: Oooh, like talking about it, I have tears, because you, I just, I don’t know, I just wasn’t expecting that curveball. And last time, like you know, you said you haven’t listened to it. I haven’t listened to it except in editing
L: Sure.
M: because it’s so hard to hear yourself a month ago thinking that everything is gonna be one way and then it’s not. (laughs) And I’m just like, “Wow. So that’s what I’ve been left with.”
L: Yeah.
M: And we, I had two cats when we got together. And we like, we did like the Uhaul thing a hundred percent. I moved in like the day that she asked me to be her girlfriend. We dated off and on for a few months and lived apart and then I moved in like that day,
L: Yeah.
M: brought my cats, and then our whole living situation ended up changing and we had six animals, which we’ve talked about, but now when I left I have zero of the animals.
L: That’s really hard.
M: And that’s another big thing that I’ve left out of the self-care part, is that, a lot of times I’ve struggled with feeling like I don’t have family,
L: Sure.
M: even though I do. I have a father. I have family, but my mom was like my main person
L: Yeah.
M: and she’s gone. So feeling like you don’t have family and support but you have animals
L: Mmhm.
M: has been like a huge part of my mental health and so now when I think about everything is gone. And so on my birthday she did text me happy birthday. I didn’t tell you this yet.
L: No!
M: It’s funny. She text me, “Happy birthday, cat mom.” And she sent me pictures of them and videos.
L: Awww.
M: And I saw it and I was like, “Sweet! That’s cute!” And then I immediately got angry and I said, “I am not their mom.” (laugh)
L: (sympathtic noise) Ohhhh.
M: And then, it was because I think what I was doing was like this protective measure in my head of being like,
L: Yes!
M: “I’m not gonna see them anymore. I’m not gonna take them. You’re gonna keep them. I don’t even, you know, they don’t need me.” And that was one of the things I struggled with as I’m going through suicidal ideation, is that was a grounding thing to me to think you have pets that need you to take care of them.
L: Yeah.
M: And then to be like, “I have nothing that needs me.”
L: I get it.
M: (laughs)
L: That feeling, no, well, and that feeling
M: I’m just gonna cry (sniffles)
L: And that feeling of just like, between, like when somebody says something kind and you’re hurt, like how angry it makes you.
M: Mmhm.
L: I, you know, like I said, it’s only been two weeks.
M: Uh huh.
L: And so the first week we were talking like, I mean, we still text. I mean like
M: Yeah.
L: you know, like pretty much every day. But we were talking a lot. And I don’t think it was inauthentic, but like, when we broke up I was like, “I might need some like complete like no contact.” And she was like, “Okay.”
M: Mmhm.
L: And then I realized like ’cause we communicate very similarly, that like, I know to not be communicated with and not know what the other person is thinking is so painful for both of us.
M: Yeah.
L: So I think we spent that first week doing a kind of back and forth like, “Just thinking about you. Just really  hope…” You know, not asking much, not processing. And I was really shocked and I think she was too by how quickly that changed for me, where I was like, “You cannot talk to me.” And a lot of that, and we’re in between that now. But a lot of that was just me reacting to those things that seem nice all of a sudden, like, she sent me a message. I’m not going to an upcoming family event on her s- her family, where our kiddo is going because it just feels a little too much for me right now. It’s next weekend. So, along those lines, and she’s been very sensitive about it. She said something like, “I hope you know you are and always will be invited to things like that.” And like, instead of me being like, “Awww.” I was like, “It’s gonna be a long time before I do that.”
M: Yeah.
L: Like that was my reaction. My reaction was like – And she didn’t do anything wrong.
M: (sighs)
L: But my reaction was just like, “I don’t, like, no.”
M: Yeah.
L: Like, “No, I don’t have family anymore.”
M: Yeah.
L: Like, “I don’t have that kind of family.” And that’s not true.
M: Yeah.
L: And like, she’ll always be my family but, you know,
M: Yeah.
L: it feels like, there is a loss of family.
M: There’s like grief.
L: There is.
M: It’s like a death in a way.
L: It absolutely is. I saw (laughs) like a meme that was like a text conversation
M: Mmhm.
L: where someone sent somebody the like multiple heart smiley face emojis and then wrote, “Fuck you.”
M: (laughs)
L: And like and then wrote, “Sorry those are conflicting emotions.” And like that is how I’ve felt I think.
M: Yeah. I think that’s how so many of us feel after breakups,
L: Yeah.
M: even with short term, and we were both coming out of longer relationships. But even, yes, I was dating someone else too, and we had a very short lasting… The last, the other people I’ve dated outside of the, my, I guess, primary or nesting partner we used to call each other, they were short, shorter, but
L: Yeah.
M: very intense.
L: Of course.
M: And I still have those, the anger and like the wanting to talk and then being like, “No. Fuck you and fuck off.” And I literally said that to the last one (laughs). I was like, “Oh, fuck off.” (laughs)
L: I know, I know. It’s
M: It’s so confusing.
L: Feelings are hard. And I think the thing too that I’m like sticking on right now is like, ’cause I talked a little bit about this the last time, but who knows, ’cause I won’t listen to it,
Both: (laugh)
L: that like we’ve had a really rough year.
M: Yes.
L: And a lot, definitely some of that was exacerbated by living together. A lot of it, there’s a lot of other things, but a lot of it was, you know, the effect of PMDD on just relationships in general
M: Mmhm.
L: and my behavior and my mood and stuff. And like now that it’s gone, I’m more equipped than I’ve ever been in my life to deal with something this difficult. But I’m so mad that I don’t get to en- not that it’s anyone’s fault. She technically broke up with me, but I, we both knew something had to just change.
M: Mmhm.
L: That’s just the change that she advocated for, and I agree. Like I don’t want to be broken up but I also don’t want to be together right now,
M: Mmhm.
L: ’cause we’re not in the place to do that. But the thing that I’m so hung up on is that how close it felt to being like, and like (sighs) like, I, we were so close.
M: Yeah, ugh.
L: And the (laughs) my, the sad song that I’ve been going on, is, I think it was one of the ones, from, I think “Both Hands” was one of the Ani DiFranco songs
M: Mmhm.
L: that I used when we did our thing. But one of the lin- it’s all about like, you know, “when we leave, the landlord will paint over the walls” and stuff.
M: Yeah.
L: Like about living together. And then it’s, “I’m writing graffiti on your body. I’m drawing the story of how hard we tried.”
M: Oh my god.
L: And like, I’m gonna cry right now. And like that’s the part that like, that’s how close, like, it’s like really, really painful right now.
M: Mmhm.
L: And I think, as a polyamorous person and a person with like, nontraditional family, like, that’s mostly a positive.
M: Mmhm.
L: And having a kid with, like, you know, she’s got four parents. And a lot of times we talk about that in this really positive way, ’cause it is.
M: Mmhm.
L: You know, more parents, more love, more people in our lives, more chosen family. So like all the good and all the joy and all the like queering of family and relationships around that has been such a positive thing. But now, as someone who’s like, I mean, you know, like I’m gonna keep dating ’cause I was always dating, you know, ’cause we were nonmonogamous. But this was still like my person and like
M: Mmhm.
L:  you know, I left my daughter’s dad when my kiddo was only two and I experienced a lot of guilt but I also was able to be like, “Well, she won’t remember us being together and that’s actually a good thing.” But now, having like another person who’s become a parent to her and us breaking up, have this fear that like, my life is gong to be like, or my daughter’s life is gonna be like a series of like, exes.
M: Mmhm.
L:  You know? Like my, like how much of my life is gonna managing, like my kid’s like time with people I couldn’t make it with.
M: Yeah. (sighs) Ugh god. So hard.
L:  And, you know, sometimes I think it’s important to like acknowledge those thoughts and be like, “That’s not the whole picture. It’s okay if you’re feeling that right now.”
M: Yeah.
(rattling sound)
M: (laughs)
L: I know. Sometimes my window just rattles
M: Uh huh.
L: like in the middle of the night too. It’s a little offputting. (laughs)
M: Me and ugh, I almost said her name, me and K
L: Mmhm.
M: I had just like, a few weeks before we broke up, thought of usually in my relationships there would be like constant breakup and get back together, breakup and get back together.
L: Mmm. Mmhm.
M: And I think one of the reasons that didn’t happen is because we were nonmonogamous. But I had just said to her, “Oh my gosh. We’ve been together for like four years without any breakups. Isn’t that crazy?” And she was like, “Yes. This is like one my longest.” Or I think it was her longest relationship
L: Mmhm.
M: and mine except for my marriage.
L: Right.
M: I was married for less time but dated that person for longer,
L: Yep.
M: you know, all together, longer.
L: Sure. When is your? When would your… When’s your anniversary?
M: November 17.
L: Okay.
M: Yeah.
L: Mine’s September 13.
M: Ugh. It’s coming.
L: Yep.
M: Oh god.
L: It’s gonna be real hard. Yeah. Well, and I think the nonmonogamy thing that you’re talking about there, like, I’m going through a weird thing where, I haven’t dated much the last year, and I think that’s for a lot of reasons. Some of it’s been like my own confidence around dating. Some of it has had to do with like my health and my energy and just my time.
M: Mmhm.
L: And some of it has had to with the face that like, whether or not this how things should be, I think it’s really hard, it was hard for me to like be vulnerable with a new person when I didn’t feel like my, and I’m using “primary” in quotes ’cause we’re nonheirarchical. We were.
M: Mmhm.
L: But we were still like, you know, cohabitating, nesting,
M: Yeah.
L: core, whatever, those words, partners. And when that relationship wasn’t working, I think I didn’t feel like, okay in… What’s that sound you’re making with your toes?
M: Ugh. (laughs) I didn’t know you could hear it.
L: Megan’s doing toe ASMR today.
Both: (laugh)
L: I think part of me was holding back from dating because that relationship wasn’t totally okay.
M: Mmhm.
L: And as things started to get better, I feel like I literally was hitting a point like within the last month, where I was like, “Okay. I’m not trying to like slot anyone in or look for something specific,” but like, I’ve been really like messaging people, going on dates,
M: Mmhm.
L: really feeling ready to date. And because we were nonmonogamous, I don’t feel guilt towards my former partner if I date. She still dates. Sometimes I know when you’re like, when you have partner who is dating and the other one’s not, you like want them to be dating
M: Yeah.
L: so you don’t have that kind of guilt. So I don’t feel guilty towards her if I date. But now I’m starting to feel like, like what I, because I’m so not used to this and I don’t know what to do with this grief that changes all the time. Do I want to put this on someone else?
M: Yeah.
L: Like is it fair for me to date other people when this
M: Yeah.
L: is what I’m going through?
M: Mmmm.
L:  Which I don’t think we have good answers for that in polyamory. I mean, I know that when I broke up with my last girlfriend before who I dated during this relationship,
M: Mmhm.
L:  during this four year thing… It was like an eight month relationship. I’ve talked about it a little bit. We’re still really good friends. So it wasn’t like a bad breakup. But when I, ’cause, and I ended it. When I broke up with her, she knew it was coming so she kind of was like, “Hey, something’s going on. Tell me what’s up.” We talked, and then she was like, “Oh. Me and my other serious partner broke up yesterday.” And like,
M: Mmhm.
L: so in some ways polyamory can be like, there’s people to support you
M: Mmhm.
L: through your breakup but in other ways it can be like oh sometimes, two of your partners will breakup with you in two days.
M: Yeah.
L: Like, yeah. So it can be really good and really bad.
M: I think that’s why I’m questioning myself being polyamorous at all.
L: Yeah. Let’s talk about that. (laughs)
M: Because I’ve had like catastrophic
L: Mmhm.
M: breakups like back to back.
L: Yeah.
M: And it would literally feel like one person’s hanging on just until I get okay enough from the other one and then they’re like, “Alright, now I’m leaving too.”
L: Mmm.
M: And well, at lunch today I had mentioned to Leigh that the common denominator of all this is me. And now being diagnosed with something new and like how much was that playing into all these things and like now my ex needing to not talk to me at all. I’m like, “Am I that bad? Am I…” blah blah blah. Just a lot of things. And another huge worry that I have is that I do want to have another nesting partner and I want to have children.
L: Yeah.
M: And I’m not opposed to doing it alone but I would rather do it with people
L: Sure.
M: or one person or whatever happens with that. I don’t really know. But it’s challenging in like the polyamorous scene,
L: Mmhm.
M: I guess, people are already partnered and have multiple partners.
L: A lot of times, yeah.
M: Yeah, a lot of times. And I feel like it’s gonna be hard. So it almost feels like the easier way to get what I want is to be monogamous because I’m going to meet someone who is also single, completely single and like build a relationship with them and that’s just the way that I’ve done polyamory before was like starting off partnered
L: Mmhm.
M: and like having a monogamous period and then opening up. But I don’t even know because I’ve just had… I don’t want to say nothing but hard times. Because it feels like that in the moment
L: Sure.
M: but there was a lot of good things to it. But it was, it’s been so hard.
L: Yeah.
M: And I’ve had more breakups because of it,
L: Yep.
M: which sometimes, you’re like, “Is it worth it?” Because I love very hard.
L: Yeah.
M: And I also again wonder how much of it is like, you know, being in mania or like the manic parts of me that are obsessive and I mean, I really, I joke about this a lot on social media. I use the hashtag #whywontyoudateme and I made the Girlfriend Material joke because I’m, it feels like my brain is constantly begging people, like, “Why don’t you date me? Why don’t you like me? Why don’t you want me to be your girlfriend?”
L: Yeah.
M: Like I just, I love labels. I love that. I love love. I love NRE. But it’s really, the reality of it is I’m not like that. I’m not like totally obsessed with people. But I have that side of me that’s like all about relationships
L: I do too.
M: and love. So it’s very hard for me to be single.
L: I think that even though there are lots of things about me and that my self esteem is pretty decent and that there are like roles I have that have nothing to do with any of this, like being a mother
M: Mmhm.
L: and things like that. The truth is that the two largest defining things for me in the last, for most of my life, have been my illness and my romantic relationships.
M: Mmhm.
L: And so, to be like better and single, are such foreign ideas for me
M: Mmhm.
L: that like I don’t even, I kind of don’t know where, like where I’m gonna land.
M: Mmhm.
L: There, I wanted to say something, when you were saying like the common denominator.
M: Mmhm.
L: That’s a thing I like, really, (sighs) I guess I feel like ’cause I’d said this about compromise too, like I have a sort of like mental collection
M: Mmhm.
L: of things that I say because they’re things I believe, like when I do work with coaching clients. But I notice most people say that, when, you know, after like not good relationships. Like you’ve even heard me say failed relationships before and like I’m really really trying not to use that word.
M: Mmhm.
L: Because I don’t believe that’s, I don’t believe relationships fail. ‘Cause it’s like, “Oh, well the common denominator in all my quote ‘failed relationships’ is me.” Well, sure, but the common denominator in everything about you is you.
M: True.
L: Well I, so the common denominator in all your great relationships and all the people that you’ve made happy is also you.
M: Mmhm.
L: So I think sometimes it can be maybe a better frame to look at it is, “The common denominator in all of my past relationships has been the choices I made. So, if I’m not happy with how that’s been, then how do I make different choices?”
M: Yeah.
L: I’ve been thinking of giving myself a little exercise that I think Masha and I talked about wanting to do – maybe you want to do it with us – which is,
M: Mmhm.
L: like really taking this moment and being single and like writing down what I want out of the next relationship.
M: Yes. I was thinking of doing a spell like that kind of.
L:  Because the truth is like I don’t know if my former partner and I will get back together. I think the fact that we’re best friends and we love each other and we’re nonmonogamous all leave space for that.
M: Mmhm.
L: But it also leaves no guarantees, which, you know, it’s important to remember that like I was also in a monogamous relationship that had no guarantees either.
M: Mmhm.
L: Nothing has any guarantees. But, either way, whether it’s her or someone else or multiple someone elses, I’d still like to go into it maybe with a better idea of what I want and what I’m looking for and then I can see, like, hey, “Does this person meet that? Do any of these people meet that?”
M: Mmhm.
L: I like, kind of like a, polyamorous relationship agreement with myself,
M: Mmhm.
L: which is what I really, my, what are my boundaries? What are my deal breakers? What are the things that I need from a relationship? ‘Cause I don’t think I’ve really sat down and done that in a long time
M: Yeah, I haven’t either.
L: or maybe ever.
M: I haven’t either and I’ve joked about that also on this podcast, being like, you know, don’t do what I do and take scraps from people just to try to make yourself feel like you have something rather than nothing.
L: Mmhm.
M: But I always do it and so outside of my last nesting partner, there was the other breakup of the person I dated last and I swear, and I told you this at lunch, and I think it’s something that has been really helpful that I’m gonna keep trying to do, like a reframe of the thoughts, were, “Why do I keep choosing people who show me their red flags?” Like that meme where you’re like, “Oh. I’ll just make a lovely scarf out of these.” I always do it. And it’s so sad to me because I think I’m such, I was like hugging myself and like, trying to like comforting or like parenting myself in a way, of like, “No. It’s okay. You’re just very hopeful. You always see the best in people and give them several chances.” Or think, “If I just lower my expectations, then I won’t get hurt anymore.” And so I’m trying to tell myself, like, “Do I want those things to change about me?” I don’t.
L: Right.
M: I will probably find someone who also appreciates that too. But it’s just so, it’s so hard and I think the older we get, well for me especially, it feels like you have more to lose.
L: Yeah.
M: You have more of a timeframe that you have to be on, like the things that I want, if I do want to get married, if I do want, I mean I can get married any time.
L: I know.
M: But if I want to have children biologically, I do have a certain
L: Yeah.
M: timeframe.
L: Yep.
M: And, just in dating queer folks, it’s been harder to find people who want children,
L: Uh huh.
M: for me. So just a lot of things that I’m like, you know, you’re sitting there with yourself and like, “Oh my god. I feel like this desperation and this rush,” and, “Why do I keep choosing people like this?” And then, you know, trying to comfort myself through that and be like, “No. You’re fine.” You know? (laughs)
L: Well, you know, so you named of the red flag memes.
M: Uh huh.
L: But like the other thing that I think like kind of goes along with your idea of like being hopeful is just a way of doing things, which is if you, which is not a bad, just is kind of a fact, which is just like if you think through rose colored glasses, red flags are just flags.
M: Yeah.
L: And like, you know, I think seeing the, I don’t know. Seeing the best in people is, I tend to see the best in people.
M: Mmhm.
L: And sometimes I get hurt because of doing that and thankfully I don’t feel that way with this former partner.
M: Yeah.
L: But I have felt that way with other parts of
M: Mmhm.
L: friendships and etc. But I don’t want to not have that. Like that’s
M: Yeah.
L: a thing I like about myself. And so…
M: Me too.
L: That’s a thing I like about you too.
M: Yeah, and I think like what you’re saying about having boundaries and knowing what you want, I think that’s the balance that I know I have to find and maybe you too is that it’s fine and I don’t want those parts to go away, but when someone says something that is a deal breaker for you, then it’s like, that has to be it. That’s what I’m horrible at.
L: Me too.
M: And you know with my last person I was dating, not to go into any details about what specifically happened, but things were said that to me were very inappropriate.
L: Yes.
M: Boundaries were crossed that were very inappropriate. And me just being like, “It’s okay. Maybe she will change or maybe I did something or maybe if I don’t do something, this won’t happen again.” And I wish for myself that I could just be like, “You crossed a boundary and that’s the end.”
L: Yeah.
M: But I just am like I can’t let go. I’m just like, “Nooo because there is these other good things.” (laughs)
L: And what is the line between not being like hyperreactive
M: Mmhm
L: with like leaving people space for nuance and to be people and to be like, “Okay, maybe this person like made a mistake that we can talk through.” Or, “Maybe this person believes this thing but like I, maybe I need to understand or step into their experience
M: Mmhm.
L: of like why they believe the thing.” There’s that. And then there’s the other side, which is like, no but like your boundaries are valid so like when do you say like, “This is something that… This is a dealbreaker for me”
M: Mmmm.
L: Or, “This is something I had a boundary about.” Like I break my own boundaries way more than anyone else
M: Yeah.
L: has broken my boundaries.
M: Ugh. It’s so heartbreaking.
L: I know.
M: I look at myself. I’m like, “Why do I do this to myself?” (laughs)
L: Well, even about my, okay, even my former partner moving in,
M: Mmhm.
L: I had a boundary that I felt like really like clear, which was we don’t want to live together now. If we ever live together in the future, I am not opposed to that, but we have to have separate bedrooms. So when the possibility of her moving in part time came up, I was like, “Well, is one bedroom half of the time that same as separate bedrooms all the time?” And like, the answer’s no.
M: Mmhm.
L: But she didn’t push that on me. I broke that boundary on my own
M: Yeah.
L: because I was like, “Ehhhh it’s close enough.” Or that was something I hadn’t thought of, right?
M: Yeah.
L: ‘Cause you can’t imagine all scenarios. So I was like, “Well I hadn’t thought about what it would look like if we lived together part of the time. Let’s try that.”
M: Mmhm.
L: But the truth is that like that was a pretty clear boundary that I set for myself.
M: Yeah.
L: And I, you know… No regrets but it’s important to remember in the future about like
M: Mmhm.
L: those kind of boundaries.
M: (sighs) Yes.
L: ‘Cause I also think sometimes I break my own boundaries as a way of people pleasing,
M: Mmm.
L: even if the other person isn’t putting any of that on me.
M: Mmhm.
L: And what it does is like, it doesn’t, not only does it like hurt me but it like doesn’t help them.
M: Yeah.
L: Like ’cause them my behavior is like the behavior of a person of a person whose boundaries have been broken and not ideal for the other person either.
M: Mmhm. Yeah. I do that too. And I just realized it that when you said it, the people pleasing or saying yes to things when the answer should be no.
L: Mmhm.
M: And then because you get someone so used to that then all of sudden when you’re like, “Hey. Actually I don’t want to do this,” then they’re like, “What the…? What? What happened? What’s wrong with you?”
L: Right.
M: And you’re like, “Nothing. This is just me but I was not following my own rules before.” (laughs) So confusing.
L: (sighs) Yeah.
M: Ugh. But it’s already been 58 minutes and we didn’t cry that much as I thought we would.
L: We didn’t! We both just like a little cried.
M: Yeah. That means we’re probably gonna have to like breakdown later and
L: Yeah.
M: cry it out.
L: I’m gonna share one last thing about crying if anyone else is like going through this kind of thing. It seems to be breakup season. So if anyone else is going through that like grief of just like and like for me, you know, I cried so much with my PMDD, that just was like, “Oh. Well this is the things that happens that’s gonna stop.”
M: Mmhm.
L: And now that’s not happening. I’m like, “I’m just gonna cry forever.”
M: (laughs)
L: There’s no stop.” And a thing that one of my friends told me that – either a friend of a therapist told her – is that like, “If you can look at it like after something happens, there’s a certain amount that you’re just gonna have to cry”
M: Mmhm.
L: “but we don’t the number. But there’s just an amount of crying until you’re okay. And so every time you’re crying, like instead of trying to stop it or trying to like feel bad about it, just feel like, ‘I’m getting closer to being done.’ ”
M: Yeah.
L: Like, “I’m getting closer to getting it all out.”
M: That’s a good way of looking at it.
L: It’s been helpful, sort of. (laughs)
M: Yeah. And well now we’re both so single that we should be very dateable so
L: Hey, hey.
M: Heeey, all the cuties in LAAAAA. (laughs)
L: We just talked about all, we’re like, “Hey, so here’s everything wrong with us and these relationships.”
M: Who wants to date?
L: Who wants to go out with us?
M: (laughs)
L: Maybe we should do a date giveaway.
M: Oh my gosh.
L: Like a date raffle.
M: Yessss. Yeah.
L: Maybe for 10,000 things [Instagram likes],
M: (laughs)
L: we should raffle off a date with one of us.
M: Yeah.
L: That’s weird.
M: Or all of us.
L: Is that weird?
M: All of us?
Both: (laugh)
L: Oh! We could do a double date.
M: (laughing) All of us!
L: I mean…
M: Me and my several personalities./(simultaneously) L: Oh my god! We could do a double date.
L: We could do a double date!
M: Yeah.
L: Because if you’re a person that’s in a relationship,
M: Yeah.
L: then you can bring your person in the relationship and Megan and I can go as a couple.
M: Yeah!
L: And if you’re like a single, like yeah, oh, that’d be fun.
M: That would be fun.
L: Okay.
M: You just have to be in the LA area to come, or willing to come…
L: Or willing to come here, yeah.
M: That would be fun.
L: Or willing to fly us somewhere else. (laughs)
M: Yeah.
L:  But then it won’t feel so much like
M: We’ll be your sugar babies if that’s what you want.
L: Definitely.
M: (laughs)
L: I’m here for that.
M: This is taking many turns.
L: We gotta go. (laughs)
M: But yeah, also we’re both on the apps and we run into people all the time who say they listen to the podcast and yaaay.
L: They do.
M: But yeah.
L: Thank you as always for listening. Thanks for hanging in for this first season.
M: Yessss!
L: We’re really excited about what’s coming next!
M: 12 episodes! Woohoo!
L: Send us your anything, your questions you want us to answer on the air, your suggestions for future podcast topics, your experience with breakups.
M: Mental stuff.
L: Mental health stuff, anything.
M: Mental stuff. (laughs)
L: Also mental stuff. Physical stuff. Emotional stuff. You know, whatever.
M: Everything. And don’t forget to subscribe and leave us a review so we can read them on air.
L: Yes, we would love that and that helps a lot.
M: Yeah.
L: The reviews help a lot. So if you can do a written review, that would be amazing.
M: That would be a fun way to start
L: Soooo great.
M: season two, reading a lot of awesome reviews.
L: And don’t forget about the Patreon. For as low as a dollar you can get a lot of cool stuff.
M: Yeah.
L: And I am back into an artistic place so I would like make you cute little things that I can mail to you so, join the Patreon.
M: Yay! And I’ve been feeling like writing so who knows? Maybe we’ll start using our blog again.
L: What!?!
M: The possibilities are endless.
L: So many possibilites.
M: Okay. Thank you so much everyone. We will see you for season two.
L: Yaaay!
M: Bye!
L: Bye!

L: Thanks for listening to Queers Next Door. We hope you enjoyed it. Be sure to follow, subscribe, and leave a review wherever you listen to your podcasts.
M: If you like what we’re doing, join the Queers Next Door fanclub at patreon.com/queersnextdoor to receive all of our exclusive content, and we’ll mail you a fun little surprise. You can find the link on our blog queersnextdoor.com. Cheers, queers!

About Queers Next Door

we take the topics you care about - sex, feminism, kink, social justice, and entertainment - and look at them through a queer AF lens. Cheers, queers! <3

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